As I knew would happen, somebody on the “Russian Women” arm of the Men’s Movement (Wolverine) has already disagreed with me about the statements that I made previously about the fact that we need to be more open to sex tourism and prostitution with foreign girls as options for ourselves and as weapons against feminism.
Because I think that this is an issue that needs to be addressed, I have turned his comment into a post.
Here are the statements that I made that he was responding to:
In fact, one of the things that I will say is that I don’t think it is feasible to have dating and marrying Eastern European or Russian or Asian girls be an official MRA policy, or something that most Western men should try to pursue, because there is just too much of a “learning curve” involved, and there are just too many dating scams and marriage scams going around to take the chance. I mean, I’m not saying that it it’s bad for the ones who think that they are capable of navigating through the “learning curve”, but I will say that I don’t think that most Western men (including myself) are capable of doing it, not because we are are untalented, but because the learning curve is just too damn steep! (A point which I will explain later.)
And another thing that I will say is that in lieu of dating and marrying these women, we need to be more open to things that were previously condemned by people such as GL and Shaun Alexander, such as prostitution and sex tourism. Because for 80% of the men in the MRA (as a guesstimate), these would be much more viable options and would take just as big a bite out of feminism and have the feminists staying up all night just as much as dating/marriage with the Eastern European women.
And here is his comment (in blue):
I’m going to disagree with you Luke. The sex tourism will only agrevate problems with the mafia, etc. Although it would put a big dent in the feminist ’self superior’ dogma, many of these girls you admire so much will become slaves because of our desires in this area. Much better to marry and leave the West then to open that can of worms with prostitution. The girls we admire so much will be bought and sold like cattle at auction in previously unheard numbers. It would be different if the girls were doing it by their own free will, but we all know that it won’t happen.
It would be much better for all if we MRA men would marry one woman each to be everything. She should be your wife, your friend, your lover, and your prostitute.
Although, you may say that I”m spouting femenist dogma about woman’s rights, I saw firsthand what losing a sister did to the prostitution trade did to my second Russian gf. The emotional stress that she had (which eventually ended our relationship) is something I would not wish on my worst enemy.
That’s my 2 cents.
First off, I will say that you are right to be worried about the Russian mafia. They are an extremely dangerous group of people.
But your solution of “we MRA men would marry one woman each to be everything,” simply isn’t feasible for most of the men in the MRA. You may not know this because you yourself are quite young, but most of the older men who have been in the MRA for a long, long time (ie DCM, Masculist Man, etc.) have stopped dating altogether because they have found out throughout their years that women expect men to satisfy them in dating and marriage, but ultimately they are creatures who can never be satisfied, whether they are American, Russian, Ukranian, or whatever they are.
For evidence of this, you need look no further than GL’s page, and his description of what Russian women expect during the dating process:
What they do instead is spend a great deal of energy looking their absolute best and they expect the right Man to take notice of this and to treat them like the Princess that they deserve to be…
Now if a Man wishes to gain any respect while Dating a Russian Woman he also needs to express the fact that she is the only Woman in existence as far as he’s concerned. She needs to feel that no other Woman in the entire Universe matters except for her… and this needs to take place usually within the first few dates!
And here is what they do if they are not treated like “the Princess that they deserve to be…”:
Even when there are No Men available these Ladies simply dive into their work and do everything possible to improve themselves both physically and intellectually.? This is not to say that they don’t get lonely for the company of a Man because obviously they do. But until that opportunity presents itself they will continue to do their own thing.
And they are fully prepared to keep their heads held high EVEN to the bitter end if needed..
And there you have it, by GL’s own admission, Russian women have something in common with American women, now don’t they? They both have the attitude of “I don’t need a man unless he treats me like a princess!!!”
And of course with women, as we all know, the definition of “princess” is not only changeable, but often sets an impossible standard for the man, because in her mind, the man must continuously make her happy, otherwise she’s not being treated like a proper princess.
Now I don’t know. Maybe you can do this. Maybe you can “crack that nut” and “climb that learning curve” (in Newexpat’s terms). But guess what Wolverine. When you add in cultural differences, language differences, etc., to women’s already demanding and never-to-be-satisfied demeanor, you find that the majority of men in the Men’s Movement (or the majority of men anywhere) can’t “crack that nut”.
And just to be clear, I’m not saying that you can’t go out on casual dates with these women, clearly you can. But as soon as she starts expecting to be “treated like a princess”, you’ve got to drop it. Otherwise you’ve opened up a can of never ending demands that are truly going to eat away at your soul.
And if what GL says is true: that Russian women always think that they should be “treated like a princess”, then the best thing to do with Russian women would be to just fuck and chuck them.
Or even better just be a sex tourist and get prostitutes.
And if the Mafia’s a problem, then perhaps we should look elsewhere.
Does that sound harsh? Well, it should.
Because this is the Men’s Rights Movement, and in the Men’s Rights Movement, we put men first.
Endnote: And just to make things crystal clear, I’m not criticizing the activities that Russian women go into when there are no men available, what GL said about them going into intellectual and other pursuits is in itself a step above the airhead barbies of the West. What I’m criticizing is women’s propensity to say, “oh, there’s nobody who will treat me like a princess, now I don’t need a man!” (That’s ok, I don’t need them either).
Another Endnote: “…then perhaps we should look elsewhere.”
And in fact it turns out that Russia and the FSU really aren’t the best places for sex tourism and prostitution nor are they the ones that I had in mind when I thought up of the idea. Bangkok and Cebu City are actually probably the best places, and those are the ones that I had in mind when I thought up of the idea, and they are the ones that I will recommend to my fellow MRA’s.
When fighting an enemy with their own tactics, one must be very careful to not become that which they despise. Right now, Luke, you should take a step back and think about what you are saying. What you are proposing will give the non feminist women of the ‘eastern’ countries a reason to become feminists. Then where would you be?? Maybe it’s better to treat the feminists that way.
BTW, how would you feel if a stranger offered your sister $50 for sex??
Maybe, right now I seem like an idealist, but I also know that people who give more seem happier for some reason.
Ironically, I asked a Polish friend what she needed to feel like a princess. She told me that just little things were enough. Bringing her a flower for no reason, doing the dishes one night for no reason, a little bit of extra attention, taking off of work early to do something special such as going to the zoo, or taking a walk in the park and perhaps a picnic, and all kinds of other little things.
She said that a $10,000 diamond necklace wasn’t necessary. She said if that was necessary, it’s time to move on, because that person doesn’t really care about the other. They just want money.
If most of the girls in Eurasia are like that, in my mind they’re worth a chance. Besides, prostitution is against my own personal morals.
Looking foreward to the next post about my opinions
Wolverine, this feminism mess that we have in the West didn’t happen because men gave women some reason to become feminists. It happened because we men were stabbed in the back by manginas and people with chivelrous ideals (aka chivelrous manginas). This is why out of the entire cast of characters in the feminist freak show I hate manginas the worst.
Ok fine, so Russian and Polish women don’t need loads of maintainance to be treated like princesses. Fine.
But that still doesn’t explain away GL’s laundry list of characteristics that men have to have in order to date Russian women (http://russianwomen.wordpress.com/2007/03/17/russian-women-and-your-nationality/), nor does it explain away Natalia’s 100 page blog of rules that you have to follow in order to date Russian women (http://russianwomenspeak.wordpress.com), and most damning to myself and other young men, it doesn’t explain away GL’s statement that men under 25 mostly simply don’t have the maturity and financial ability necessary to date Russian women.
The point is, Wolverine, that women simply don’t need men the way that they did in times long past (whether they be Russian, American, or whatever). That’s a fact that came along with the onset of the modern Post-Victorian era. Thus they’re able to be incredibly picky and choosy and set standards that a lot of men can’t meet (see GL’s laundry list), and also when they get tired of one man they can simply move on to the next.
Yes I have dated women in the past Wolverine. But it isn’t something that happened because of anything I did. It’s something that happened only because I had incredibly good luck, and happened by sheer chance to be in the right place at the right time.
What I’m saying about prostitution and sex tourism is that it is a way to put at least some of the power back into the hands of men. Because to tell you the truth Wolverine, without it we are in a situation in which they don’t really need us, and we still need them. Have you ever seen those shirts that Western women wear that say “I have the pussy so I make the rules”. Do you actually think that that’s any less true in Russia even though they don’t have those shirts in Russia? Maybe it is, but only because of things like demographics and prostitution (which I’m not sure is legal in Russia, but I know that it exists there). Granted, both Russian women and Polish women have many other things to offer than sex (whereas that seems all that Western women have to offer), but it is a major thing that women hold over men (in the current system), and they are using it in the West to continue feminist oppression of men. Both Masculist Man and I seek to put a big dent in that, and that is why I came up with this idea about sex tourism and prostitution.
Luke, I could not disagree with you more with regard to prostitution and sex tourism. This post is filled with contradictions.
You are rightly upset about the low standards of femininity of the Feminazi West. But the solution to this is not to lower the bar for Western men. The solution is to meet the challenge of becoming our best possible selves.
You see challenges as barriers. And they are not. Yes, the finest things in life don’t always come so easily. In fact most often they don’t.
And yes, you are right that most young men are not in a position to pursue a full life with a Russian girl. So, what is your alternate? Prostitution? Sex tourism? Both ideas are entirely naive and without regard to the best longterm interests of Real men, not to speak of the interests of the girls.
And most especially the girls who must do it as a result of mafia kidnappings and multiple rapes which are used to break a girl’s resistance to prostitution and her philosophy that her sexuality is beyond the value of a simple monetary sum. The ones who refuse outright are simply murdered. And you support this?
And what does this say about you? That you are so abhorrent a man that your only sexual option is to pay a girl to have sex? Any lady’s man knows that his “A” game is on when the girls in his life are “open and receptive” to him from their point of view and they are in pursuit of you. When a man has his stuff together, Luke, the girls let you know in some very obvious ways. There is no arm twisiting.
The theme here, to which wolverine refers, is that in order to establish a true and enduring love, that this task must be met with a learning and self-development curve which can then reasonably establish this. And I entirely support this.
How can you simultaneously denigrate the Feminazi’s and girly men, while complaining about having to raise your own standards? Remember, they have successfully separated males from their individual celebration of masculinity. Being a prostitute’s customer is masculine? Not in my lifetime pal.
So, what do you do in the meantime? You become attractive to all girls, even the Feminazi’s… in a general sort of way. And then, when you can have many girls, you select from among the best, entirely disregarding those with even a hint of misandry.
In other words, ‘Yes, I know that you want me. But, sorry Babe, you’re simply not good enough to be my wife and the mother of my children.”
If you have to pay for it; then, this is the result of a social vote of girls who say that such men are simply not worth spit. And I agree.
So, James Bond must pay for sex? Um huh.
Desire must be inspired. Spreading her legs for American dollars is a vote that your “spit” isn’t worth spit.
Rexpat, I’ve made your comment into a post, and I’ve responded to it. You can see my response here.
I’m going to change the name of this article because MRA’s have already been doing sex tourism and prostitution for a long time. Therefore this article needs to be called “Response to an Objection to What I Said About How MRA’s Need to Keep Doing Sex Tourism and Prostitution”